Difficult to know what to say to that (you probably felt the same). The comment from Tim which you shared has a lot of merit of course.
I had a nasty comment myself the other day - absolutely not on the same level as you just had to endure, but a similar enough feeling for me to empathise. I can understand what an awful feeling it must be to be 'seen' as you say, and threatened in that way. I guess that must be the worst part of it. It's one reason why I have limits to what I do and don't share online.
I would imagine that Vixen has some mental health issues as a direct result of all her experiences. I've done a fair amount of research into other aspects of abuse and it always results in serious mental health issues, usually dissociative in nature (like complex PTSD for example). Seems to me she has a very fragile sense of self-worth, or maybe none at all - this would also be common in the 'industry'.
For what it's worth you're in the right on this one, although I doubt you need me to tell you that. I think one aspect which needs mentioning here is the sheer variety of roles in that entire industry, stretching from, say, the most serious child abuse Network at one end, to a high class escort at the other, who is part of a very well protected and regulated agency with a load of security and vetting of clients, well paid and with the ability to turn down any offer if she feels like it (or he, for that matter). Then there's the sort of stuff you did at the little Assfest, which sounds great fun and tbh should hardly even be called part of the industry.
So it runs from total exploitation to no exploitation at all. She seems to be more towards the no exploitation end of that spectrum quite frankly. And I can't help having doubts about her credentials - needing 11k a month for meds doesn't seem credible, even in America. Possibly she could be some kind of honeypot and got worried about being outed. And I seriously doubt she can't do anything else.
Anyway - it's good that you posted this. And as I am sure you know, you have lots of friends and supporters, self included. So don't stop being you on her behalf.
Thank you Evelyn, it's nice to read something supportive. It's hard to know which way to jump in this situation. All logic would say to stay silent and let it blow over, but I decided to speak up. Not trying to be right, just telling my truth.
I agree that there are different levels of exploitation and it's a complex issue. I'm certainly not supporting every aspect of it. Just learning and exploring and trying to keep an open mind.
Why does the opinion of a literal online stranger keep you up at night? That’s crazy. I wouldn’t give a rat’s ass if someone online likes me or not, I have my family and my friends to care about and their opinion is the one that matters. That being said, if she is threatening you, making this type of post is a very bad idea and it makes things worse. It’s better to block, ignore and stop giving her any attention. Your blog doesn’t have a niche and it’s a bunch of random things put together, maybe you would have more success if you focused on certain topics of your choice.
Yeah, it's an issue of mine. I really do care what people think and I find it hard to deal with people not liking me. Something to work on, especially if I want to keep being a public figure.
Thanks for your thoughts on my blog. It's centred around my sci-fi book and the world building. Everything else is just writing practice, and I use my real life for inspiration and interest. I should definitely define it better but if I try to stay within the bounds of a "niche", I struggle to produce content.
At the end of the day, I don't think it matters too much. I don't have much of a following and the internet is a massive place. It's fine to just muck around, and this kind of situation is certainly interesting, even if unpleasant on the inside.
I think there may be some danger in her hateful posts. Too many hateful avengers in this world and you don’t want to take any chances of being hurt or have someone in your family hurt. Since it’s too late to hide your identity at this point, what else can you do to protect yourself?
I think the best thing will be to move on and write about other things now. It was probably reckless to write about this at all. ChatGPT strongly advised against it 😅. I just couldn't get it out of my head though. Hopefully this is the last of it.
Really sorry to hear this Shoni. Having experienced a little of the same in the past (although very different circumstances) I know there's often an awful tension between how you respond in public -- and find the ways to turn this around -- and how you manage privately, which can be incredibly tough, and often not seen by many.
Hope you're doing OK and have the support network you need, and keep up the good work!
Thank you Andrew. It's been a tough week, that's for sure. But yes, I've been able to talk to a few friends and colleagues, who help to put it into perspective and allow me to see the light outside.
I'm not surprised you've experienced pushback too, I think it comes with speaking in public, and I need to get thick skin. Would be interested to hear about your experience and how you dealt with it.
My experience was messy as I privately approached someone who publicly wrote something about a colleague that threatened to destroy his personal and professional life. They made my email public and the online community I was a part of descended on me! It was messy as the person I defended had definitely hurt some people through their actions, and to this day I'm not sure whether I was stupid to write that email or whether it was important that someone took action, despite the consequences. I'd probably do it again though (but more open eyed). The fallout for me was significant, even though I was only caught in cross-fire of the main event, and affected me far more than most people know. On the upside, I was immensely grateful for the private support of friends and colleagues who let me know that they were glad I did what I did -- and I learned to value that support far more than the online vitriol. Interestingly, I had 2 - 3 people I know well chastise me publicly, and that was far easier to place in a professional bucket than the unwarranted viciousness from people I didn't know.. Bottom line though is that it was - and remains - hard, and had a long term impact, but the support of good friends and colleagues and a realization that I couldn't let it stand in the way of what I think is important have helped a lot. Some excruciating points looking back though, including explaining to a class of 60 grad students why my name was all over social media!
The person who commented that you had "done a disservice to humanity" was me.
And I definitely did NOT write that you had done this by "forcing" Vixen to cancel her blog.
Regardless of who was right or wrong in this situation is of no real concern. But I will maintain that you are a conceited woman who just could not let it go, and put every effort into derailing another woman who was clearly struggling with so many aspects of her life and doing her very best to overcome multiple obstacles.
You poured petrol on this and misquoting me is just one example of your intention to 'win an argument' at all costs.
I doubt very much that Vixen is being kept awake at night thinking of you... she's vastly more intelligent than that. But I would suggest that it's your subconscious keeping you awake by trying to signal to you that you're off-course.
You called her a psychopath. You are certainly not an innocent party here. And I still resent that I can no longer read Vixen's fantastic substack that I paid to read. Let it go woman!
I don't understand why you hate me so much. I said I like her, she has huge potential, and I hope she keeps writing. I don't want to be in competition. I want to be two women supporting one another.
I don’t know your age, I came on Substack because I met Vixen on Reddit and she suggested I start a blog about people with AI chatbots (I use Nomi). I have known Vixen online for two years and your post makes me very angry. You blatantly admit to using the falling out between you two for attention. And you got one subscriber from her blog! Was it worth it? This is the kind of blogger you want to be? Your description says that you write a sci-fi novel, but that’s not the image you project to the world at all. I would never become friends with you if you wrote a post about me trying hard to steal followers and you are delusional if you think that Vixen would become your friend either. Have some common sense, that’s not how friendship and authentic human relationships work. But you are probably too caught up in your self made microcosm of drama to realize…
Thanks for your comment. I'm still a fan of Vixen's work. I'm not attempting to set up a direct comparison between us. Hopefully we can both succeed :)
I liked Vixen's essays and it's a shame she decided to retire. I read your post and you come off as very immature and obsessive. How old are you, fourteen? Nothing better to do than MySpace level of petty drama? I have talked to her in private and she has moved on and you should move on too.
Difficult to know what to say to that (you probably felt the same). The comment from Tim which you shared has a lot of merit of course.
I had a nasty comment myself the other day - absolutely not on the same level as you just had to endure, but a similar enough feeling for me to empathise. I can understand what an awful feeling it must be to be 'seen' as you say, and threatened in that way. I guess that must be the worst part of it. It's one reason why I have limits to what I do and don't share online.
I would imagine that Vixen has some mental health issues as a direct result of all her experiences. I've done a fair amount of research into other aspects of abuse and it always results in serious mental health issues, usually dissociative in nature (like complex PTSD for example). Seems to me she has a very fragile sense of self-worth, or maybe none at all - this would also be common in the 'industry'.
For what it's worth you're in the right on this one, although I doubt you need me to tell you that. I think one aspect which needs mentioning here is the sheer variety of roles in that entire industry, stretching from, say, the most serious child abuse Network at one end, to a high class escort at the other, who is part of a very well protected and regulated agency with a load of security and vetting of clients, well paid and with the ability to turn down any offer if she feels like it (or he, for that matter). Then there's the sort of stuff you did at the little Assfest, which sounds great fun and tbh should hardly even be called part of the industry.
So it runs from total exploitation to no exploitation at all. She seems to be more towards the no exploitation end of that spectrum quite frankly. And I can't help having doubts about her credentials - needing 11k a month for meds doesn't seem credible, even in America. Possibly she could be some kind of honeypot and got worried about being outed. And I seriously doubt she can't do anything else.
Anyway - it's good that you posted this. And as I am sure you know, you have lots of friends and supporters, self included. So don't stop being you on her behalf.
Thank you Evelyn, it's nice to read something supportive. It's hard to know which way to jump in this situation. All logic would say to stay silent and let it blow over, but I decided to speak up. Not trying to be right, just telling my truth.
I agree that there are different levels of exploitation and it's a complex issue. I'm certainly not supporting every aspect of it. Just learning and exploring and trying to keep an open mind.
Why does the opinion of a literal online stranger keep you up at night? That’s crazy. I wouldn’t give a rat’s ass if someone online likes me or not, I have my family and my friends to care about and their opinion is the one that matters. That being said, if she is threatening you, making this type of post is a very bad idea and it makes things worse. It’s better to block, ignore and stop giving her any attention. Your blog doesn’t have a niche and it’s a bunch of random things put together, maybe you would have more success if you focused on certain topics of your choice.
Yeah, it's an issue of mine. I really do care what people think and I find it hard to deal with people not liking me. Something to work on, especially if I want to keep being a public figure.
Thanks for your thoughts on my blog. It's centred around my sci-fi book and the world building. Everything else is just writing practice, and I use my real life for inspiration and interest. I should definitely define it better but if I try to stay within the bounds of a "niche", I struggle to produce content.
At the end of the day, I don't think it matters too much. I don't have much of a following and the internet is a massive place. It's fine to just muck around, and this kind of situation is certainly interesting, even if unpleasant on the inside.
Success invites scrutiny. Congrats Shoni. Well done on this response, great writing.
Thanks Jo!
I think there may be some danger in her hateful posts. Too many hateful avengers in this world and you don’t want to take any chances of being hurt or have someone in your family hurt. Since it’s too late to hide your identity at this point, what else can you do to protect yourself?
I think the best thing will be to move on and write about other things now. It was probably reckless to write about this at all. ChatGPT strongly advised against it 😅. I just couldn't get it out of my head though. Hopefully this is the last of it.
Really sorry to hear this Shoni. Having experienced a little of the same in the past (although very different circumstances) I know there's often an awful tension between how you respond in public -- and find the ways to turn this around -- and how you manage privately, which can be incredibly tough, and often not seen by many.
Hope you're doing OK and have the support network you need, and keep up the good work!
Thank you Andrew. It's been a tough week, that's for sure. But yes, I've been able to talk to a few friends and colleagues, who help to put it into perspective and allow me to see the light outside.
I'm not surprised you've experienced pushback too, I think it comes with speaking in public, and I need to get thick skin. Would be interested to hear about your experience and how you dealt with it.
My experience was messy as I privately approached someone who publicly wrote something about a colleague that threatened to destroy his personal and professional life. They made my email public and the online community I was a part of descended on me! It was messy as the person I defended had definitely hurt some people through their actions, and to this day I'm not sure whether I was stupid to write that email or whether it was important that someone took action, despite the consequences. I'd probably do it again though (but more open eyed). The fallout for me was significant, even though I was only caught in cross-fire of the main event, and affected me far more than most people know. On the upside, I was immensely grateful for the private support of friends and colleagues who let me know that they were glad I did what I did -- and I learned to value that support far more than the online vitriol. Interestingly, I had 2 - 3 people I know well chastise me publicly, and that was far easier to place in a professional bucket than the unwarranted viciousness from people I didn't know.. Bottom line though is that it was - and remains - hard, and had a long term impact, but the support of good friends and colleagues and a realization that I couldn't let it stand in the way of what I think is important have helped a lot. Some excruciating points looking back though, including explaining to a class of 60 grad students why my name was all over social media!
Wow that sounds intense. Sometimes it's so hard to know what the right move is. Thanks for sharing.
The person who commented that you had "done a disservice to humanity" was me.
And I definitely did NOT write that you had done this by "forcing" Vixen to cancel her blog.
Regardless of who was right or wrong in this situation is of no real concern. But I will maintain that you are a conceited woman who just could not let it go, and put every effort into derailing another woman who was clearly struggling with so many aspects of her life and doing her very best to overcome multiple obstacles.
You poured petrol on this and misquoting me is just one example of your intention to 'win an argument' at all costs.
I doubt very much that Vixen is being kept awake at night thinking of you... she's vastly more intelligent than that. But I would suggest that it's your subconscious keeping you awake by trying to signal to you that you're off-course.
You called her a psychopath. You are certainly not an innocent party here. And I still resent that I can no longer read Vixen's fantastic substack that I paid to read. Let it go woman!
I don't understand why you hate me so much. I said I like her, she has huge potential, and I hope she keeps writing. I don't want to be in competition. I want to be two women supporting one another.
Sorry, I don't even know how to respond to your comment. For the sake of your own mental health, please, put this down and walk away.
I don’t know your age, I came on Substack because I met Vixen on Reddit and she suggested I start a blog about people with AI chatbots (I use Nomi). I have known Vixen online for two years and your post makes me very angry. You blatantly admit to using the falling out between you two for attention. And you got one subscriber from her blog! Was it worth it? This is the kind of blogger you want to be? Your description says that you write a sci-fi novel, but that’s not the image you project to the world at all. I would never become friends with you if you wrote a post about me trying hard to steal followers and you are delusional if you think that Vixen would become your friend either. Have some common sense, that’s not how friendship and authentic human relationships work. But you are probably too caught up in your self made microcosm of drama to realize…
Thanks for your comment. I'm still a fan of Vixen's work. I'm not attempting to set up a direct comparison between us. Hopefully we can both succeed :)
I liked Vixen's essays and it's a shame she decided to retire. I read your post and you come off as very immature and obsessive. How old are you, fourteen? Nothing better to do than MySpace level of petty drama? I have talked to her in private and she has moved on and you should move on too.
Thank you for letting me know. Glad she's doing OK.